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Hapuga
September 13th, 2009, 18:01
I cant get my created maps going. What may be the problem?

I put all needed parts, dungeon hearts, portals, gold.... Doesnt want to work.

Ðârk Âñgêl
September 13th, 2009, 18:21
how is that ?
doesnt it appear in the map list ?

check the things:
- click on skirmish and multiplayer in level variables (level)
- save global data > yes.

Hapuga
September 13th, 2009, 18:30
Thanks a lot! Helped.

Hapuga
September 13th, 2009, 18:37
Now there is another problem. Game crashes every time I try to load the map.

dk2player
September 13th, 2009, 19:57
Can't help you. Game crashes are too random to pick out one thing wrong. Just keep tring untill it works

Madkill
September 13th, 2009, 20:48
Now there is another problem. Game crashes every time I try to load the map.

What is in the map?


As in, are there many Heroes placed about the map?

Make sure that there are no creatures placed where there is a door/trap also.

Hapuga
September 13th, 2009, 22:40
Well, sorted it out. official editor seems to hate the 1.3 game version. you can't create new maps with it. However, I've learned how to cheat on it ;)

1.3 supports only official maps and some random maps. Find the map that runs okay, copy the map file "mapname".kwd, so that you have copy of "mapname".kwd.

Now, create another map on the basis of the original "mapname". Edit, change, do whatever you want. when the map is ready, save it, cal it "mapname 1" for example. Rename all the "mapname 1" files into copy of "mapname". Now, with Hex editor, open previously created copy of "mapname".kwd. You will see, that this file is empty, save some redirection lines. you will see, that this file redirects info to all other files (players, things, map etc). Now it shows sth like maps/"mapname"Map.kld . You have to rename them all into copy of "mapname" respectively.

You're done!

Ðârk Âñgêl
September 15th, 2009, 16:19
yea i think you can only play the maps on 1.7 as far i know.
but still have a look on things madkill mentioned.
dont create bugs in maps, like placing 500 knights or a trainingroom with size 50X50 :D

Hapuga
September 15th, 2009, 17:42
read my previous post :)

Madkill
September 15th, 2009, 23:01
It was a bit foolish to make a map for 1.3 when the map maker was designed for 1.51 and onwards. :spider:

Hapuga
September 16th, 2009, 11:17
It may, for those who have 1.51 running on their PC's.

It may, if you like the idiotic AI of 1.7.

I'm not one of those people.

dk2player
September 16th, 2009, 14:21
The ai is not that stupid. If you give it forever, it might surprise you.

Hapuga
September 16th, 2009, 16:29
The problem is, no one wants to wait forever, right?

dk2player
September 16th, 2009, 23:15
exactly

Dark_Omega MK2
September 16th, 2009, 23:46
The problem is, no one wants to wait forever, right?

i do D=

Madkill
September 17th, 2009, 14:31
Bad map = Bad ai.


Good map = not as bad ai.



:spider:

Hapuga
September 17th, 2009, 17:39
Bad map = Bad ai.


Good map = not as bad ai.



:spider:

Fail.

dk2player
September 17th, 2009, 23:35
Bad Ai= Bad map

Good Ai= Semi Good Map

Great Ai= Offical maps

Dark_Omega MK2
September 17th, 2009, 23:56
Bad Ai= Bad map

Good Ai= Semi Good Map

Great Ai= Offical maps

define "good" or "semigood" map...

Madkill
September 18th, 2009, 10:37
Fail.

Explain.

Hapuga
September 18th, 2009, 10:53
Explain.

AI = script (or number of scripts) where commands are written.

The layout of the map does not change AI goodness or badness. if AI does not attack in 1.7, no matter the map greatness, it will not work for him. If the AI does not drop creatures, map wont help him. If AI cannot train creatures in combat pit, map wont help him. If AI cant manage his resources well, map can not help him.

AI script only uses the resources of the map. Thats all.

What can be altered:

Gold in larger chunks are seen better by the AI.
Portals near base are seen by AI, far portals are ignored.
Premade rooms attract specials, AI doesnt build them himself.
Smaller maps tend to work better in therms of exploration for AI.

If you call things that are above "a good AI" than we are talking about different things.

To make a BETTER AI you have to alter the AI script, now me and Jibbits are trying to do this.

To make AI BETTER RESPOND on the map, check the map for things listed above.

Do I make myself clear now?

Madkill
September 18th, 2009, 11:03
So when I said-

Bad map = Bad ai.


Good map = not as bad ai.



How exactly did I fail?

All of what you mentioned about 'What can be altered' are what I had in mind of what makes a good map.

Hapuga
September 18th, 2009, 12:06
Because the AI is bad in both instances in 1.7 this is my point.

Madkill
September 18th, 2009, 15:08
With the exception that if you make a good map, the ai wont perform as bad as it would on a bad map.

Hapuga
September 18th, 2009, 15:09
Tell me one simple thing.

Will it throw armies of creatures on me?

dk2player
September 19th, 2009, 02:58
no, but their creatures may get angry and leave.

Hapuga
September 19th, 2009, 09:41
no, but their creatures may get angry and leave.

I am sorry, but I would like to hear Madkill's answer.

Madkill
September 19th, 2009, 10:34
Tell me one simple thing.

Will it throw armies of creatures on me?

I've no idea about that, but they'll at least build up a formidable force of creatures.

Hapuga
September 19th, 2009, 15:34
I've no idea about that

So what are we talking about? Lets end this discussion.

Madkill
September 19th, 2009, 16:25
So what are we talking about? Lets end this discussion.

because-


but they'll at least build up a formidable force of creatures.

Some formidable force of creatures to fight due to it being a good map is better than a bad maps' level-crap force of creatures.


Hence why a bad map = bad ai and a good map = not as bad ai.
(Its still bad, but not as bad.)

You dug your grave now lay in it. :spider:

End~

Hapuga
September 19th, 2009, 16:46
Ok. You like to play with a "not as bad AI" that will never ever threaten to attack you - go for it.

I don't find it fun, so let me play a 1.3 version where someone ocasionally attacks me at least, ok?

dk2player
September 19th, 2009, 16:49
ok

Hapuga
September 19th, 2009, 18:03
ok

That was written not to you dk2player.

dk2player
September 19th, 2009, 18:07
hey, I agree with you, can't I express it.

Hapuga
September 19th, 2009, 18:12
Oh. I thought otherwise. Nevermind, sorry.

Madkill
September 19th, 2009, 20:37
Ok. You like to play with a "not as bad AI" that will never ever threaten to attack you - go for it.

I don't find it fun, so let me play a 1.3 version where someone ocasionally attacks me at least, ok?

http://www.nerve.com/CS/blogs/61fps/2009/01/facepalm.jpg

Hapuga
September 19th, 2009, 21:34
So, what was your point in this thread, friend? A lil' trollin'?

Madkill
September 19th, 2009, 22:44
You're the one trolling mistah. Not me.

So cut it out already. This wasn't about what your preference of what a good ai is.


This was how a badly-created map's ai keeper differs from a goodly-created map's ai keeper.

Though the only difference being minor; it's still different in one not being as bad as the other.

I've no idea how you can't get this into your head yet. :spider:

Hapuga
September 19th, 2009, 22:49
Well, it was you who told that it was foolish to make a map for 1.3. I explained myself why I did it. And this nonsense with better AI and not so good AI and Bad AI and blah blah began.