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Blanchflower
December 8th, 2013, 03:51
OK, I am using Dungeon Keeper FX and am having trouble beating the final level, Skybird Trill. The problem is, in the early stages of the level, I get this message which says, "What treachery! The Avatar's body could not be found...". Then a few minutes later, before I can train all my creatures to level 10, the Avatar and his minions appear in the west side of the map as well as the other hero gates found in the east of my location.

This happens even before I have a chance to defeat the Avatar which is being held in the prison on the North-East of the map. I thought that the 2nd Avatar and his minions would only appear AFTER I have defeated the Avatar in the prison?

Am I missing something here? I watched some YouTube videos on this level and found that that the 2nd Avatar only appears after defeating the Avatar in the prison. Did FX change the AI behaviour?

Please advise. Thanks.

:eek:

mefistotelis
December 8th, 2013, 11:01
I recently modified the script for that level, so most likely I just made a mistake somewhere.

EDIT: Just checked, I don't see any mistake.
Avatar must have died. Blue player killed him?
Do you have a saved game, specifically just before the "treachery" message?

Blanchflower
December 8th, 2013, 12:24
I recently modified the script for that level, so most likely I just made a mistake somewhere.

EDIT: Just checked, I don't see any mistake.
Avatar must have died. Blue player killed him?
Do you have a saved game, specifically just before the "treachery" message?

Thanks for the kind reply. It could be that the Blue player killed him. However, I can't be sure about this.

By the way, I do have a save game for this. The question is, how do I upload the game to this forum? Could you provide me with a step by step instruction on how to go about doing this? I am not too good with computers by the way. Thanks again for the reply.

Skarok
December 8th, 2013, 12:28
Well, before uploading files on this website it's advised to delete System32 from your computer. It seems to cause problems when uploading files to this website.

DragonsLover
December 9th, 2013, 00:13
Here's I think what happened:
- Blue Keeper imp accessed to the hero dungeon heart, claiming the unaligned flies and beetles
- Flies and beetles destroyed the hero dungeon heart
- The priestess and horny that were imprisoned between hero doors got free and they moved along the north-east path smashing the door to attack the blue keeper
- A fight probably occurred near the enemy dungeon heart, causing the priestess to cast her wind spell and moving the avatar away, or maybe she pushed back where the avatar is and blue creatures started attacking the avatar
- You know the rest

Blanchflower
December 9th, 2013, 07:31
Here's I think what happened:
- Blue Keeper imp accessed to the hero dungeon heart, claiming the unaligned flies and beetles
- Flies and beetles destroyed the hero dungeon heart
- The priestess and horny that were imprisoned between hero doors got free and they moved along the north-east path smashing the door to attack the blue keeper
- A fight probably occurred near the enemy dungeon heart, causing the priestess to cast her wind spell and moving the avatar away, or maybe she pushed back where the avatar is and blue creatures started attacking the avatar
- You know the rest

I played the level the 2nd time and managed to get to the dungeon heart on time before the Blue keeper did. But I got the same message, "What treachery! The Avatar's body could not be found...". I don't get it. Why would the Blue keeper attack the Avatar which was being held as a prisoner?

Blanchflower
December 9th, 2013, 09:48
Yes, I have finally beaten this level! I played the level the 3rd time and this time I was quick. I guess that the message appears when the Avatar in the prison gets killed. One should not be too slow in this level: D

mefistotelis
December 9th, 2013, 17:23
I don't get it. Why would the Blue keeper attack the Avatar which was being held as a prisoner?

Actually, he's not really held as prisoner. He is just held on an island surrounded by lava, and that's why he's not escaping.

I wonder how could we prevent blue player from attacking him..

- We could really make him a prisoner; but wouldn't he starve to death? And what if I implement torturing by computer player? Then blue player would have converted Avatar, which also doesn't seem right.

- We could add a script command to create "blacked out area" for computer players - a place which computer players can't influence. But then, computer won't attack human player in that area, which could be easily abused (ie. get an archer and attack heart from distance).

- We could make a temporary alliance between blue and white players (until white heart is destroyed); but in that case, blue player will never attack white players heart (it usually happens quite late, but he attacks sooner or later).

Hades
December 9th, 2013, 17:51
What about putting guard posts up at the Hero dungeon doors at the north face?

Blanchflower
December 10th, 2013, 01:02
Actually, he's not really held as prisoner. He is just held on an island surrounded by lava, and that's why he's not escaping.

I wonder how could we prevent blue player from attacking him..
.

I watched at least 3 different YouTube videos on how to beat this level and each time, the Blue Keeper did not even attempt to attack the Avatar which was being held in the prison. And they were not using the Keeper FX mod. It is strange that while I used this mod, the Blue Keeper seems to be very aggressive and attacks the Avatar pretty early on.

DragonsLover
December 10th, 2013, 03:18
Next time, try it again, but either alter the script to reveal all the map at the beginning or edit the level to put a reveal map bonus crate next to your dungeon heart. Then, take a look of what happens.

Blanchflower
December 10th, 2013, 04:07
Next time, try it again, but either alter the script to reveal all the map at the beginning or edit the level to put a reveal map bonus crate next to your dungeon heart. Then, take a look of what happens.

Thanks for your kind reply. But as I am a newbie when it comes to the FX mod, I really have no clue on how to alter the script or put a revel map bonus crate next to my dungeon. By the way, if you could be so kind, can you post me the link on how to go about doing this? I may be a newbie when it comes to editing the script but I am willing to learn as I love this game a lot.

Thanks!

:rolleyes:

mefistotelis
December 10th, 2013, 08:28
I watched at least 3 different YouTube videos on how to beat this level and each time, the Blue Keeper did not even attempt to attack the Avatar which was being held in the prison. And they were not using the Keeper FX mod. It is strange that while I used this mod, the Blue Keeper seems to be very aggressive and attacks the Avatar pretty early on.

Now when you mention it - I don't really know which part of code makes the attack.
Computer player commences attack when:
- His creature is under attack and he wants to defend it
- He is doing good and he wants to commence attack on enemy (but in that case enemy room is attacked, not random enemy creature)

I can't remember any code for attacking enemy who is just walking in computer players territory.

Noanechu
December 10th, 2013, 19:01
Well, I had the enemy keeper constantly using call to arms at random points(even at my dungeon - one time a vampire was able to teleport himself there...) of the map and and mocking. Guess this was caused by fights between his warlocks and vampires. Maybe the warlocks should be removed from the level to avoid trouble. One of the points for call at arms was the "prison" of the Avatar - and against a group of level 10 vampires and the enemy keeper using lightning even he has no chance, so the attack of the hero wave was triggered.

DragonsLover
December 11th, 2013, 01:08
Okay, yeah, if the enemy keeper can actually attack his own prison, then there's a big problem! The script command in the level file should only aim the human player so, Noanechu, if you see an enemy CTA spell being cast on your territory, it's NORMAL. There's a command that tells the computer player to make an attack on your dungeon several times. Once the enemy vampires know your territory, they can teleport immediately in your dungeon, sometimes straight on your dungeon heart, sometimes on your prison, sometimes on your treasure room or others.

Noanechu
December 12th, 2013, 19:02
Ok, but how does he know my territory? Is it revealed to him from the beginning on? Fortunately I only had it once that an enemy vampire was able to teleport there.

DragonsLover
December 13th, 2013, 05:29
Computer players, when there's a path open toward your dungeon, know where you are kinda automatically.

Hades
December 13th, 2013, 11:12
Computer players, when there's a path open toward your dungeon, know where you are kinda automatically.

And hero tunnelers seem to know exactly where you are.

DragonsLover
December 14th, 2013, 00:14
If the script tells them to go toward you, then yes.

Mothrayas
December 14th, 2013, 22:11
AI is a cheating bastard.

In fact, in most games, more often than not this is true.

Omniscience (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheAllSeeingAI) (like the above two cases) is just one of the more common ways the AI 'cheats'. Most AI systems do not have any concept of fog of war.