Dungeon Keeper RPG idea

[Hades]

Here's an idea I've had for a Dungeon Keeper RPG:

- The Keepers have slumbered for centuries since The defeated them.
- As of the present day, the Continent of Marnus (The size of South America) is divided between four major powers.
- The Republic of Marnus (A military dictatorship in all but name, and the most powerful nation on Marnus. Think of a mixture of Pinochet's Chile and Post-1991 Russia)
- Pountren (A Parliamentary Democracy more in line with 1910s Britain)
- The Kingdom of Linada (A Constitutional Monarchy along the lines of pre-WW1 Germany and modern Holland)
- Nirex State (Fascist State along the lines of Mussolini Italy, and the weakest nation on Marnus)
- Tech is somewhere between 1970s/90s. However, nukes are rare in this setting.

Anyway, Main story:
- 681 P.A. (Post. Avatar)
- Cold War between Marnus and Pountren/Lianda boils over and goes into their equivalent of WW3
- However, a Marnian nuclear strike on Pountren positions causes the Dungeon Keepers to stir from their sleep.
- as the war progresses on, and the main powers are weakned, the Keepers begin to emerge and claim the continent of Marnus as their own.

[NerdyTB]

What? Dungeon Keeper in what is basically the equivalent of the modern era? You'd have Goblins and Mistresses against AK-47s and Howitzers. That's a pretty one sided battle if I've ever seen one. Even a Black Knight would have problems against an assault rifle.

[Hades]

I was thinking maybe the creatures would be stronger in this setting (For example, and would be very resistant to anything less than armour piercing rounds, while require rocket launchers)

Or maybe it's a Fallout 3 style setting where the Keepers invade a post apocalyptic nightmare, expecting lush green lands to pillage, and instead finding people clinging on to their last hopes in this nightmare of a post-nuclear war Marnus.

[Metal Gear Rex]

Well if you want to be apart of the Awakening RPG, I can show you around with the rules and everything. But you shouldn't expect to just propose a new RPG idea and have everyone just jump onto it the the moment it arrives. If we did that for every new idea, we'd never really accomplish anything as we'd just have all these unfinished RPGs about. (not to mention, a load of wasted forum space) And we can't really split our attention between numerous RPGs because, well, let's be realistic. There is simply not enough time to spare for everything. I think we have enough difficulty keeping the Awakening RPG active as it is.

I will, however, perform a more in depth analysis of your idea so you know I'm not just shooting it down just because we don't have the time to go through with it. I presume that's the kind of serious response you seek as you wouldn't otherwise propose such an idea without expecting it to be a potential success.

* * * * * * *

Firstly, let's begin with the Dungeon Keepers' presence in the world. Heroes, or general societies existing in this timeline, have reason to be digging around in the underground. The reason for a more modern day digging would be for building of things such as a subway system. However, I think Heroes would have been mining around long before that as everyone knows there's gold in the underground by this time.

So the question is, how would Dungeon Keepers avoid being detected with all this mining going on? They would be asleep, and have no way of knowing the Heroes are digging around, so they really can't try and hide or anything. Additionally, if even one Dungeon Keeper is discovered, I'm sure the news would spread like wild fire that there are still Keepers around and they will likely begin a hunt to rid the world of any still living Dungeon Keepers.

Another question is how did the Dungeon Keepers avoid getting awoken sooner? I'm sure all of this mining would have awakened at least a few of them. They would then likely begin attacking the Heroes to bring about their revenge.

One of the main problems that arises from this thinking of digging out gold is that... by the time the Dungeon Keepers awaken, there will likely be little Gold for them to actually use. Aside from paying their Creatures, gold is needed to build rooms, traps, and doors. With so little gold, Dungeon Keepers will be at a serious disadvantage from the very start.

* * * * * * *

Now one other thing to think about is... how will Dungeon Keepers or Creatures even function in the modern world? They would not have grown up in that world, so they would have no idea how anything works. Dungeon Keepers are asleep and Creatures are stuck in the Portal Pools, as there's no one to free them without the Dungeon Keepers. Down there, there's no chance they could have had an increase in technology. They just don't have the means to do it.

Another question that comes to mind with this is the simple relationship between Dungeon Keepers and Creatures. How would Dungeon Keepers appear under the eyes of a Creature? With so much time passed, it's unlikely that they would even remember them. There's no effective way for them to record information down there. Dungeon Keepers would have the problem of regaining the loyalty of the Creatures. There are two main motivating factors of why Creatures join Dungeon Keepers. The first is due to a hatred for the Heroes and The Avatar especially as they're the reason why they're in those pits to begin with, having locked them down there centuries prior to the Dungeon Keepers' arrival. The second is because life outside the Portal Pool and in the dungeon is much better. With a lack of resources to build a proper dungeon and the lack of Heroes' existence, it effectively destroys both reasons of why Creatures would bother risking their lives for Dungeon Keepers.

* * * * * * *

What defines the "Modern World" anyways? If only things could be as simple as saying "It's like 1970s to 1990s". Realistically speaking, things are far more complex than just that. There are two magics the Heroes would have improved overtime during these centuries that the Dungeon Keepers slept. Literal magic, and then the magic of science. And they would not have just improved each form of magic individually. They likely would have found ways to combine the two and advance overall technology further. There's really no excuse as to why they would eliminate magic either. So in truth, it's very possible that the technology they have is beyond what we even have today.

I'm certain things like the internet were possible back then if you add magic into the mixture. Computers existed back then, and the internet could be made by combining that technology with Teleport magic, creating a much more effective internet speed. Airships could easily exist thanks to Flight magic. Not to mention, with spells like Protect and Speed, things could be built much faster and more efficiently than ever before. Let's not forget that Giants are apart of this world too, as are Fairies and Elven Archers. Giants would likely be more sophisticated by now, and capable of doing a lot of heavy work to further improve efficiency of construction. Fairies are pretty magically powerful too, and can also play a part in this.

So I'm sure you get the point by now. Technology and magic would have both been vastly improved by this point in time.

* * * * * * *

Now going into the war itself... well, let's face it. Dungeon Keepers don't stand a chance. Even if we ignore the problems they'll be facing with resources and manpower, they still have the serious problem of being clearly outmatched. It's not Magic vs Technology as you might be thinking, but Magic vs Technology and Magic. It's not really a fair fight, especially considering that both Technology and Magic would have improved since the age of Dungeon Keepers. Magic vs Magic alone would be enough for the Dungeon Keepers to lose for that very reason.

Additionally, since there is currently a conflict going on between modern factions, there will also likely mean an arms race. That means that war technology would have also been bolstered by this point in time, too. They would have magic on par or even beyond that of a Dungeon Keeper or even possibly The Avatar, and it would be more widespread. They'll be all warmed up for when Dungeon Keepers appear. There will definitely be a massive slaughter, and it won't be Dungeon Keepers that perform the slaughtering.

* * * * * * *

I see what kind of idea you're going for. And I agree, a Magic Vs Technology war would be kind of interesting. But when you seriously/realistically try to apply the idea, well, it really fails for reasons you see above. The only way for it to actually have a decent chance of working is if we did a serious bending of reality and reason, enough to the point that it might be difficult to take the idea seriously. And even after that, there will be a lot of time and effort needed to be spent to think out the actual specifics of how the RPG idea will function, to the point that it's probably not worth it. That alone is also enough to kill the idea dead.

So in short, this idea is not very good.

[MeinCookie]

Early space exploration + refined Teleport magic. I wouldn't be surprised if the heroes had colonized other star systems and had the full mineral wealth over every other rock within their own flowing back to them.

Personally, I think the early-mid 1800s is a much more compelling time period. Massive construction projects such as the London sewers, mass production and technology coming into its own, the global predominance of the British Empire, Redcoats everywhere and officers in 'shoot-me' hats. If you export that into a Dungeon Keeper universe - it is pretty awesome.

All of this is academic though, because who has the time?

[Metal Gear Rex]

All of this is academic though, because who has the time?

dotted. And yet he still mocks us.

[Hades]

Ok, how's this?

Republic of Marnus
Established 339 P.A.:
The preceding Kingdom of Marnus had been around since before the Keeper Wars, and was a major force behind the final defeat of Keeper Belial. However, in the years following the Keeper Wars, the Kingdom grew more and more unstable, as the Royal Family became crueller and colder. Eventually, Civil War broke out in 310 P.A., and ended with the exile of the Royal Family under the last King, Maximilian IV. Since then, a Republic was established, which did not address many of the fundamental issues that led to the Civil War. Terrorist attacks and political intrigue were commonplace in Republican Marnus, and politicians were often assassinated. The last straw for the Republic came in 483 P.A. when Consul Michael Renac was implicated in a massive corruption ring. The military under General Alexander Jinac mounted a coup d'etat and turned Marnus into a military dictatorship that persists to this present day. Almost immediately, Jinac began to crack down on what he perceived as the problems in Marnus, with the Senate being abolished, Freedom of Speech being suppressed, The current ruler of Marnus is General Elizabeth Brent, who rules the country with an iron fist. However, she has also crafted the image of a reformer and a moderniser, with many megaprojects being undertaken in order to facilitate growth for Marnus's economy, which has become as important as ever in the Industrial Era. Although Marnus is the most powerful nation on the eponymous continent, it still faces hostility from the neighbouring powers, especially with General Brent pursuing a highly aggressive foreign policy and modernisation of the military, which is already the largest military on Marnus, with 3 million non-conscript men and women under arms. However, Brent's modernisation programme means that the Marnian military will operate at a limited capacity for the next 4 years, but is still a formidable force.

Kingdom of Lianda
Another Kingdom that pre-dated the Keeper wars, and was a major contributor to the 's efforts to destroy the Keepers that had been plaguing Marnus. However, unlike the Republic of Marnus, Lianda had managed to avoid the instability and unrest that plagued it, which has allowed for far smoother governance, especially with the Reform Laws of 308 P.A, which ceded a significant amount of the King's power to the Parliament. Under King Frederick IX, Lianda has enjoyed unbelievable prosperity, and has proven itself to be a major power. Its credibility on the continent was bolstered by its resistance to the Republic's aggressive expansion policy, and had fought against Marnus when it annexed what is now the Dunast Province in 490 P.A. After this battle, Lianda established alliances with various powers, including the nascent Nirex State, and remains the only major power bloc that can check Marnus's aggression. Although it is not as strong, its economic prowess and allies more than compensate for its military weakness.

Nirex State
The weakest of the "big 3", Nirex was a democratic Republic on the eponymous island that managed to avoid the worst of the Keeper Wars, but due to its alliance with Lianda, remains a counterbalance to Marnus.. Over the centuries, Nirex traded with various powers, and entrenched itself as an powerhouse to be reckoned with. Its small size is not to be underestimated, as it has successfully resisted attempts by the Republic of Marnus to annex it. It has remained a stable country under First Citizen Rex West.

General notes.
- The continent of Marnus is undergoing an industrial revolution, with various hyperprojects being undertaken, such as the sewer system and underground fresh water system in Marnus, various dams in Lianda and the Mantlescraper residential areas in Nirex
- The two main power blocs have 16 colonies overseas between them, with the continent of Resita being carved up by the two powers.

Basic timeline
- The Keeper Wars ran from 40 A.A to 0 P.A, when the emerged from hiding to directly confront the Keeper Empires with an alliance headed by Lianda and Marnus, wih the disappearing shortly thereafter. The Keeper Empires' defeat at Spirestalk forced them deep underground, plotting revenge. Over the centuries, they began spying on the surface world, and remained in awe at the Humans' technological progress.
- The Dunast incident in 516 P.A leads to the War for Marnus beginning between the Republic of Marnus and the Nirex/Lianda Alliance. Within 6 months, 1 million soldiers die on all sides, with the death rate accelerating
- Fort Reginald, a newly constructed fort on the inner border of Marnus, discovers a vast network of underground tunnels, and this panics the Keepers.
- They decide to attack now, and Marnus/Lianda/Nirex find that their own infrastructure is being turned against them.

[Metal Gear Rex]

I have the sudden feeling of deja vu. Have I gone through this sort of situation before? I have, haven't I?

I will respond only to some key elements to save myself precious time.

The preceding Kingdom of Marnus had been around since before the Keeper Wars, and was a major force behind the final defeat of Keeper Belial.

So I'm guessing you're going to perform a massive retcon over a lot of things throughout DK1 and DK2 in order to try and make your idea work, yes? Because Belial was killed back in DKII on Level 11, by the Player or as we call him, Keeper "Malice". And none of these kingdoms actually existed prior or during either. At least not the latter.

The Keeper Wars ran from 40 A.A to 0 P.A, when the emerged from hiding to directly confront the Keeper Empires with an alliance headed by Lianda and Marnus, wih the disappearing shortly thereafter. The Keeper Empires' defeat at Spirestalk forced them deep underground, plotting revenge. Over the centuries, they began spying on the surface world, and remained in awe at the Humans' technological progress.

So you tried to answer how the Keepers are able to keep up with technology, but you do not answer how they were not easily discovered. When I ask this, I'm mostly referring as to why all Hero forces just simply let the Keepers go. I mean they knew they didn't kill all the Keepers if they just fled deeper underground. I have to wonder why no one ever pursued after them to ensure they're killed off or at least eternally trapped under there like the Creatures.

Even if you can answer these questions successfully, you still run into another problem that will always persist as it's born from the very core of this idea. That being, that you start to lose the Dungeon Keeper feel with magic and fantasy and all that when you throw too much modern technology into the mix. It can also make things hellishly complex. That is probably the biggest issue you face with this idea and ironically the one that you seem to be missing.

* * * * * * *

I would honestly stop if I were you. Don't waste your time or your energy on this. In order to get your idea off the ground, you'd have to work out everything, and I mean everything, all by yourself. Why? Because I certainly don't have the time, energy, or interest required to help. If I had the time to do that, I would instead use it to shorten that long to-do list I have for the Awakening. Most other RPers are in a similar situation. If they had all this free time for this idea, then they would instead use it to keep the RP we already have in a healthy state. I would be very disappointed in them if they did otherwise.

Since you have an interest in RPing, I would like to again advise in joining the Awakening. You can get started with RPing right away rather than having to spend all this time trying to work out another RP idea that might not even work out in the end. And even if it does, you still have to get people to join it, and that will cause the forum to be split between the two RPs. That will cause problems for both of them in terms of activity. So really, this is a bad idea one way or another, and that's why I advise not pursuing after it.

If you still want to go after it though, well I can't stop you. But I'm going to take my own interest and not spend my time on it in terms of replying/criticizing it. Just try not to spam up the forum with it, as this forum is specifically meant for the Awakening RP.

Edit:
Also, I moved this thread out of the Test Forums and into the Awakening forum. Best place to put it, I suppose.