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Thread: General Improvement Mod - A New Unofficial Patch for DK2

  
  1. #141

    Default Re: General Improvement Mod - A New Unofficial Patch for DK2

    I guess I didn't explain myself out well. What I meant with ''Rushing'' a DKII remake was that I guess no one's obligating anyone here to actually make a fix for this game, so no one should really feel obligated that they should do it cause it's their ''duty'', as these are fans who like the game so much, they would try to fix it theirselves.

    Again, sorry if I stirred anything up, especially when mentioning War for the Overworld o.o;

    WFTO has been on a beta for so long, and I've never been fond on spending to buy betas unless it's the full product, and I'm not going to judge it until I see what it is they will give in the full release
    Last edited by Zabii; April 30th, 2014 at 01:34.

  2. #142

    Default Re: General Improvement Mod - A New Unofficial Patch for DK2

    Quote Originally Posted by Wyrmcast View Post
    I think that technically WTFO would fall more under the definition of being in alpha, rather than in beta (unless they made a lot of progress lately). And anyway, I don't think betas are normally supposed to last for years. But whatever.
    Dota 2 kinda did that for quite some time...

    Then again, let's hope WFTO makes a turn for the better and doesn't become a below average spinoff like Dungeons or Impire

  3. #143
    Awakening Game Master Metal Gear Rex's Avatar
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    Default Re: General Improvement Mod - A New Unofficial Patch for DK2

    Quote Originally Posted by Zabii View Post
    Again, sorry if I stirred anything up, especially when mentioning War for the Overworld o.o;
    Don't worry, you didn't really stir anything up. A lot of, well, that, is just a personal rant about WftO. When you actually look at a lot of the points made, most of it is just criticism for not being technically Dungeon Keeper. Personal preference type things. Wyrm dislikes a lot of DK2 actually because he prefers DK1, so it's kind of expected for him to dislike WftO for similar reasons. He falls under the category of people I mentioned that simply prefers one of the official games.

    However, I do feel slightly obligated to reply to one point simply because I don't like the spreading of rumors.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wyrmcast View Post
    2.) I believe it was originally started as a free/open source project for the fans, to make DK3. Seems like a totally broken promise. I guess Simburger wanted to make a bunch of money, but I don't know.
    Actually, it's more a case of the team getting realistic. A fanmade DK3 can only go so far, and since EA never replied to any attempt at contacting them to give the project the greenlight, all the project had was a hope that EA didn't notice it or if they did notice it, that they didn't care enough to bother shutting it down. They're more likely to do such more towards the final stages of the project, as it would probably have made quite the name for itself. Then all of that hard work would be for naught. Where would everyone be then?

    At least now, the project has a future. If the team is properly funded, then they also have a future in that field of work. I don't really see how it's an issue, nor why Simburger in particular is getting a finger pointed at him for this.
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  4. #144
    Elite Dragon Mothrayas's Avatar
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    Default Re: General Improvement Mod - A New Unofficial Patch for DK2

    I'm not going to argue against Wyrmcast's opinions - he can have his own opinion of WftO whatever he wants - but some facts need to be clarified here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wyrmcast View Post
    3.) (...) (maybe if they would have kept non-profit they could have gotten around this.
    That doesn't help. EA has issued C&Ds on free property remakes before.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wyrmcast View Post
    I think they even had a letter of permission from EA at some point
    No

    Quote Originally Posted by Wyrmcast View Post
    which would have applied, if they would have stayed on Keeper Klan forum at least).
    Very no. That requirement would be downright silly.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wyrmcast View Post
    5.) Has cheap knock-offs of DK units, such as the Blood Imp, Succubus, Pixie etc., due to copyright fears. But this isn't even necessary, because EA has no basic right to Imps, Goblins, Warlocks, Trolls, Giants, Demons, Mistresses, Angels, Dragons, Salamanders, etc. Might be a good idea to not have the units completely the same in appearance/aspects, but except for the more unique units in DK like Horned Reapers or Bile Demons, most of the DK units are themselves ripped off from either the fantasy genre, Lord of the Rings or real life. It's just annoying coming from playing DK to seeing things like Blood Imps run around, which are so different for no real justification, especially when this was originally started as a DK fan sequel.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Derivative_work
    http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ14.pdf

    It is necessary, because if you just rip off half of the DK material, WftO can still be held accountable on copyright infringement (depending on how picky EA is, and believe me, they would be).

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  5. #145
    Elite Dragon Mothrayas's Avatar
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    Default Re: General Improvement Mod - A New Unofficial Patch for DK2

    Quote Originally Posted by Wyrmcast View Post
    It might unfortunately be the law in the U.S. that you can copyright your own copyright infringements by calling them "derivative works", but if that is the case... That would be pretty stupid. I would have to question the competency of anyone who created such a policy.
    You may have missed the point of what I wrote (and linked to). It states that, to be copyrightable, a derivative work has to be different enough from the original or must contain a substantial amount of new material to be regarded as a "new work". If there is not enough difference, then WftO won't "copyright" their 'copyright infringement', they'll be taken to court by EA instead.

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  6. #146
    Your Majesty Hapuga's Avatar
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    Default Re: General Improvement Mod - A New Unofficial Patch for DK2

    Quote Originally Posted by Wyrmcast View Post
    Well, when you put it that way I can agree with you.

    But I still think WftO could probably use more generic versions of goblins, orcs, dragons, mistresses, salamanders, rogues, knights/black knights etc. without infringing anyones' copyrights (except the goblins and orcs would technically violate Lord of the Ring's copyright, I think - although not many people seem to care about that anymore). I agree that straight-up copying things like Horned Reapers or even the Mistress design/costume probably wouldn't go very well. There would be a need to be either a lot more unique or generic compared to DK versions. But the concepts and even names could probably be fundamentally the same.
    You still don't quite understand. You look at every creature/element in particular. You should look at the whole concept in general. Make all units goblins and trolls - no problem. Start adding name specific units - here's a problem. It's like, if I have a unit called siege tank in my game, I'm probably ok. But if I have siege tank, vulture and goliath then I'm probably copying starcraft. Same here. Black Knight and Mistress are very specific units by themselves, but putting them in a combination is even worse.
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  7. #147

    Default Re: General Improvement Mod - A New Unofficial Patch for DK2

    Going back to the topic of the mod itself...

    My game keeps crashing when I hover my screen over a Lord of the Land. Seems it usually happens with Lords who are level 7+

  8. #148

    Default Re: General Improvement Mod - A New Unofficial Patch for DK2

    Quote Originally Posted by Wyrmcast View Post
    Last resort you could try playing the game version GOG 1.7 (the GOG hardware acceleration patch).
    Yes I played with the GoG version and the game won't crash when hovering over the lord of the land, so it might have something to do with my current graphics card. I have had minor problems in other games where looking over a certain thing would cause my games to crash.

    Also as a side note, I remember reading in one of the patch notes that the vampires now need to eat two chickens, and they indeed eat when I drop chickens on them, however they never seem to actually go to the hatchery, or get angry when they haven't eaten after so much time.

    Was this change in a patch note and I may have just missed it?

  9. #149
    Awakening Game Master Metal Gear Rex's Avatar
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    Default Re: General Improvement Mod - A New Unofficial Patch for DK2

    Quote Originally Posted by Zabii View Post
    Also as a side note, I remember reading in one of the patch notes that the vampires now need to eat two chickens, and they indeed eat when I drop chickens on them, however they never seem to actually go to the hatchery, or get angry when they haven't eaten after so much time.

    Was this change in a patch note and I may have just missed it?
    I took a quick look at the stats of the latest release.

    Vampire Hunger Fill: 2
    Vampire Hunger Rate: 32767

    So, Wyrm forgot to change the Hunger Rate, it's at the default 32767 value.

    Also.

    Vampire Anger (No Food): 1

    This is also the default value, so Wyrm never changed this either. It's an extremely low annoyance value, actually. After the 32767 seconds pass to make the Vampire hungry, it would take 16399.9999999993 seconds for him to become unhappy. This doesn't include the time it would take him to become actually angry.

    Two things to take note of though. This is with Game Time, so 100% speed and this is assuming my calculations on how the mood values work are correct. However, I've had a lot of testing to back myself up so it's unlikely that I am incorrect there.
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  10. #150
    Awakening Game Master Metal Gear Rex's Avatar
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    Default Re: General Improvement Mod - A New Unofficial Patch for DK2

    I tested both of these things just now to confirm them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wyrmcast View Post
    I'm pretty sure I did try to change those values, and that they didn't really have any effect in getting the vampire to go eat on his own. So I just put them back at the defaults for the release.
    No, the Vampire goes to eat. He has a proper eating animation as well. I remember trying this with the Skeleton as well, when I was much younger and still experimenting with the editor. It worked with the Skeleton just fine too, and he doesn't even have a proper eating animation.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wyrmcast View Post
    I think the hunger values only really affect how fast vampires starve to death in prisons - which is a pretty odd situation for a vampire to be in anyway.
    Close. The actual hunger values won't effect the specific amount of damage that Creatures take in prison. That value is defined in level variables, rather than the global configuration data. However, it seems hardcoded or something that Creatures with a Hunger Fill value of 0 will also take 0 damage from the Prison. I tried it with both the Skeleton and the Vampire. Giving them a hunger value greater than 0 will cause them to take damage from being in the prison, but it doesn't matter how extreme these values are so long as they're greater than 0.
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