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Thread: KeeperFX version 0.32

  
  1. #1
    Fly dragonfist's Avatar
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    Default KeeperFX version 0.32

    This is what I experienced in KeeperFX version 0.32

    1. My gold did not sink below 4600, while all vampires kept on training.
    2. I was not able to buy spells, not even a 150 imp, although I had 4600.
    3. Only 1 in 5 prisoners returned to Skeletons, if I am right, the other 4 prisoners returned to vampires in the Graveyard, after my imps brought the bodies there.

    I was shocked. I would after playing read the script of the level I played, a recent made level Duke Ragereaver, that is posted here. None of these things I was able to find in the script. So I must asume, that these are new laws, that come with KeeperFX version 0.32, from what I would read on one of the things here on this forum, where only 1 in 5 Prisoners becomes a Skeleton.

    I'm curious what version 0.33 will bring. Off course, it's Mefistotelis who makes a program, he can do what wants. And I can more or less understand these choices, but in my opinion, such decisions should be made by a player or maybe certain levels, even a campaign, not by an interface that plays Dungeon Keeper. If there are commands for such changes in KeeperFX scripting language, that's nice. But a user being dependent on such changes while having no power over it, creates a new game with new laws, and at a certain point will not be Dungeon Keeper anymore, but an other game with Dungeon Keeper Graphics used.

    My arguments to change nothing are:
    1. 0 Gold = 0 Gold. The game gives a warning with -1000 Gold. Creatures are scripted to destroy the Dungeon, leave it through the portal. Empty treasure rooms. If a minimum of 4600 Gold is found, all these things are thrown away. This might be used in one level, one campaign, or setting by a player, but having it default is boring, because less exiting and no humor.
    2. 1:1 Prisoner to Skeleton creates a huge amount of training cost, training room to small, and an alternate army, needed for certain levels that have no Graveyard and Portal. Or a very small Graveyard. The game is balanced on 1:1, because Skeletons are rather weak, their strength is from numbers. Also, if a Graveyard is available, a player might want to prevent Vampires to come, like for keeping down payday costs, or needed work force in the Workshop. Vampires can not work, but Skeletons can. This is almost not possible any more, if 4 Prisoners return to corpses and become Vampires. An example of the importance of the 1:1 balancing, is the Deeper Dungeon level Abbadon, where enemy keepers can be destroyed by using traps, but there is no portal only prisons and a small Graveyard.
    3. No gold for training, is a nice way to get creatures to rest this last health leave in their lair, or get some to a workshop for traps and doors, or some to a Library for a while to study. It's not a problem if the creatures can not train, contrary, if the creatures train to much with little Gold, payday costs will increase, because creatures demand more pay when on a higher level.

    It makes me think of a KeeperFX discussion I would read at the previous Invisionfree forum, where people would suggest all kinds of things, by that changing the game. I would back than already very much disagree with that, I would suggest people take these idea's to War For The Overworld discussions. Not for KeeperFX. The possibilities for KeeperFX are much more than this, because making these things possible in script commands or maybe a user interface for the player, where he can set up how to play a game, is much better than what is happening now. Dungeon Keeper is a classic game, and if some one thinks he can improve the best game ever made, he is making a mistake. Some one will say: Stop creatures from having a fight in their lair, or, stop creatures form being hungry, or, stop creatures from dying. In my opinion, if such things should be implemented, and they are cheats, it should be done by a trainer. KeeperFX is the greatest program, if it is just an interface, that makes playing Dungeon Keeper possible...

    Your arguments whether I am right or wrong please.

  2. #2
    Awakening Game Master Metal Gear Rex's Avatar
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    Default Re: KeeperFX version 0.32

    I experianced the 4600 gold glitch, and the not being able to cast spells when I had enough money glitch too. I wonder if it had anything to do with my large sum of treasuries and low sum of gold... but I couldn't cast heal speed monster without it saying I don't have enough gold. I don't remember if I used KeeperFX or not though... hard to remember. I'd give a log if hadn't overritten it already. >.<

    1/5 skeletons? Oddly specific cause I couldn't get any, but easily changable. Just go to the fxdata and go to the Game Rules file. Easiest thing from there is to go to use Find for Skeleton. Change it to 1.
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  3. #3
    Fly dragonfist's Avatar
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    Default Re: KeeperFX version 0.32

    Quote Originally Posted by Metal Gear Rex View Post
    1/5 skeletons? Oddly specific cause I couldn't get any, but easily changable. Just go to the fxdata and go to the Game Rules file. Easiest thing from there is to go to use Find for Skeleton. Change it to 1.
    I found creatures.cfg in the fxdata directory. Please stop using the word easy there... Okay, how do I get the default Dungeon Keeper laws back in the game there?

  4. #4
    Awakening Game Master Metal Gear Rex's Avatar
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    Default Re: KeeperFX version 0.32

    Quote Originally Posted by dragonfist View Post
    I found creatures.cfg in the fxdata directory. Please stop using the word easy there... Okay, how do I get the default Dungeon Keeper laws back in the game there?
    I only used it twice, but technically never since I used two different extentions of the word. But why is that a problem?

    Well you could copy and paste the stuff from the original creature.txt file into the different KeeperFX files.
    Dungeon Keeper 2 Patch: With More Balance and Pie [Hiatus]
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  5. #5
    KeeperFX Author mefistotelis's Avatar
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    Default Re: KeeperFX version 0.32

    The skeleton chance:
    This mechanism was present in original DK; it must have been broken - and I just fixed it. I will change the config in next version to give 100% skeleton chance by default.

    The gold problem:
    Looks like it's a bug. Will fix that. Can I have a saved game where it happens?

  6. #6
    Dragon DragonsLover's Avatar
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    Default Re: KeeperFX version 0.32

    Yeah, in Dungeon Keeper (not FX), there were some game values commands in creature.txt/dd1creat.txt based on chance to get Skeletons and Ghosts :

    Code:
    GAME_GHOST_CONVERT_CHANCE    21    0
    GAME_PRISON_SKELETON_CHANCE    50    1
    I'm presuming that the developers of the game decided, with these commands, not to constantly gives Skeletons and Ghosts all the time, perhaps for game balance. It can become interesting features, giving some randomness for getting Skeletons and Ghosts. And like Mefisto said, perhaps it was broken in the original game, like some other things. And now that it surely works properly, perhaps it could be interesting to have a little lower value than 100% like, say, 95% or 90% so that failing conversions may occur a very few times. What do you think?
    I like dragons! They're the center of my life! I'll never forget them...



  7. #7
    Awakening Game Master Metal Gear Rex's Avatar
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    Default Re: KeeperFX version 0.32

    100% Chance for Ghost
    50% Chance for Skeleton

    Ghost are weaker so always is good
    Skeletons are also good too

    Vampires need 10 bodies, so it is a choice between 10 Ghosts, 5 Skeletons, or 1 Vampire and remembering Vampires start at level 1 while others start at level they were at.
    Dungeon Keeper 2 Patch: With More Balance and Pie [Hiatus]
    Forever Hiatus. Probably. Latest Version: 3.5 w/Levels 1-11 Revised.

    The Awakening: GM Powers Activate!
    Tesonu is napping!

    LOL, WFTO

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