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Thread: New creature info panel

  
  1. #1
    KeeperFX Author mefistotelis's Avatar
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    Default New creature info panel

    I want to introduce another creature info panel, to allow showing more creature stats to the player.

    First panel shows:
    Code:
    Kills
    Strength
    GoldHeld
    GoldWage
    Armour
    Defence
    Luck
    Dexterity
    AgeTime
    BloodType
    For 2nd one, we also need 10 parameters; currently I'm missing 3:
    Code:
    Speed
    Loyalty
    ResearchSkill
    ManufactureSkill
    TrainingSkill
    ScavengeSkill
    Score
    Any ideas what to put there? And what is your general opinion about this idea?

    I will need icons and text descriptions for the new stats.

  2. #2

    Default Re: New creature info panel

    What does Score do?

    TrainingCost, ScavengeCosts

    beyond that, I got nothing.

  3. #3
    Awakening Game Master Metal Gear Rex's Avatar
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    Default Re: New creature info panel

    Health? There's also Recovery, Lair Size, and Hunger Fill. Probably should have all the combat related stats on one panel and other dungeon management related stats on the other. The first panel should be about combat stats as it follows the Creature's Spell Set.

    Funnily enough, I've never had a complete understanding on what Loyalty does. I also don't know how the Time in Dungeon stat is calculated. At least from what I remember, it always seemed to be around 30 or something.
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  4. #4
    KeeperFX Author mefistotelis's Avatar
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    Default Re: New creature info panel

    Quote Originally Posted by Metal Gear Rex View Post
    Health? There's also Recovery, Lair Size, and Hunger Fill. Probably should have all the combat related stats on one panel and other dungeon management related stats on the other. The first panel should be about combat stats as it follows the Creature's Spell Set.
    Sounds good.

    Quote Originally Posted by Metal Gear Rex View Post
    Funnily enough, I've never had a complete understanding on what Loyalty does.
    It's used to calculate scavenge points required for creature to join enemy.
    I don't fully understand the formula, though:
    Code:
        scavngpts = (dungeon->field_94B[thing->model] + 1) *
          compute_creature_max_loyalty(crstat->scavenge_require, cctrl->explevel);
    Quote Originally Posted by Metal Gear Rex View Post
    I also don't know how the Time in Dungeon stat is calculated. At least from what I remember, it always seemed to be around 30 or something.
    Code:
            i = (game.play_gameturn-creatng->creation_turn) / 2000 + cctrl->joining_age;
            if (i >= 99)
              i = 99;
    where:
    Code:
    cctrl->joining_age = 17+ACTION_RANDOM(13);

  5. #5
    KeeperFX Author mefistotelis's Avatar
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    Default Re: New creature info panel

    Quote Originally Posted by YourMaster View Post
    What does Score do?
    adds to your score at end of the level, and is used in fight code (attacking weaker enemy player, selecting fight opponent amongst nearby creatures).

  6. #6

    Default Re: New creature info panel

    I'll post my questions comments from the issue tracker here,....

    • Loyalty confuses me to. The creature.cfg mentions loyalty grows by 35%(of base value) per level. However, the creature files all have Loyalty listed as 0, except for the hell hound. Is there more than one loyalty value?

    • I suggest reordering some of the stats of the first panel so that they naturally go together. Strength versus armour, Defense versus dexterity. I would include speed here, as that is one of the mayor combat skills. That means one needs to be taken out, I suggest BloodType. Leaving:

      Kills - Time in Dungeon
      Gold Carried - Pay
      Strength - Armour
      Dexterity - Defense
      Speed - Luck

    • On the page that shows these stats, there is no mouse over on the health bar(because this is a different health bar than on the other screen). What would be a nice enhancement would be to get the mouse over: "Creature health: [Health]/[MaxHealth].


    Quote Originally Posted by Metal Gear Rex View Post
    Health? There's also Recovery, Lair Size, and Hunger Fill. Probably should have all the combat related stats on one panel and other dungeon management related stats on the other. The first panel should be about combat stats as it follows the Creature's Spell Set.
    So that means you suggest moving pay and gold held to the second info panel?
    Combat stats:
    1. Strenght
    2. Armour
    3. Dexterity
    4. Defence
    5. Speed
    6. Luck
    7. Recovery

    Dungeon Management
    1. Gold held
    2. Payday
    3. Research
    4. Manufacture
    5. Training
    6. Scavenging
    7. TrainingCost
    8. ScavagingCosts
    9. Lair Size
    10. Hunger Fill
    11. Loyalty

    Other
    1. Blood type
    2. Score
    3. Time in Dungeon


    This leaves 21 stats for 20 spots. If the mouse over isn't happening, we could include MaxHealth as a combat stat coming up to 22. Add BloodType and Score as combat stats, and Time in Dungeon as a Management stat. Resulting tabs would be:

    Strength - Armour
    Dexterity - Defense
    Luck - Speed
    MaxHealth - Recovery
    BloodType - Score

    Gold held - Payday
    Research - Manufacture
    Training - Scavenging
    TrainingCost - ScavagingCosts
    Lair Size - Hunger Fill
    Loyalty - Time in Dungeon

    That would be one row to many for dungeon management, where I would keep the top 3 rows, and take out one of the bottom 3 rows.
    Last edited by YourMaster; August 19th, 2014 at 19:11.

  7. #7

    Default Re: New creature info panel

    Alternative would be to keep the two gold ones in place of course, on the first tab, and remove Score and either BloodType or Recovery from this tab. So this:

    Gold held - Payday
    Strength - Armour
    Dexterity - Defense
    Luck - Speed
    MaxHealth - Recovery

    Research - Manufacture
    Training - Scavenging
    TrainingCost - ScavagingCosts
    Lair Size - Hunger Fill
    Loyalty - Time in Dungeon

  8. #8
    Awakening Game Master Metal Gear Rex's Avatar
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    Default Re: New creature info panel

    I want to go with a sort of counterpart stat comparison in the row / column organization as well.

    My Suggestion:

    Combat Panel
    Code:
    Health		Recovery
    Armor		Strength
    Defense		Dexterity
    Speed		Luck
    Score		Kills
    Health I think should be the first stat shown, it seems awkward for Health to be anything other than first. As a result of this, however, the first column is now devoted to defensive based stats while the second column is offensive based. The organization for the rest is fairly straightforward.

    Since Score is said to be used in fight code and defines target priority, I felt it should be in the Combat Panel.

    Management Panel
    Code:
    Lair Size	Hunger Fill
    Training Skill	BloodType
    Research Skill	Manufacture Skill
    Scavenge Skill	Loyalty
    Gold Held	Gold Wage
    Lair Size and Hunger Fill are the simplest forms of dungeon management, so I felt they should be first. After that comes working tasks, then the Pay at the end of the day.

    Since Loyalty is used in Scavenging, I made it the counterpart to the Scavenge value.

    I do not want to use Training Cost / Scavenger Cost because both these stats are very easy to see just by putting a Creature in one of the two rooms. Lair Size and Hunger Fill are less obvious while still being important, so that's why I used them. Although, Lair Size is much more important to include than Hunger Fill as the latter can also be seen fairly easily.

    There's actually a blank spot as the counterpart to Training Rate. I'm not sure what to put there as it's a contest between either Age in Dungeon and Blood Type. I don't want to put in Training Cost without putting in Scavenger Cost, so I decided between Blood Type and Time in Dungeon. The former I thought would be more interesting as a fun stat so I put it in.
    Dungeon Keeper 2 Patch: With More Balance and Pie [Hiatus]
    Forever Hiatus. Probably. Latest Version: 3.5 w/Levels 1-11 Revised.

    The Awakening: GM Powers Activate!
    Tesonu is napping!

    LOL, WFTO

  9. #9

    Default Re: New creature info panel

    Quote Originally Posted by Metal Gear Rex View Post
    I want to go with a sort of counterpart stat comparison in the row / column organization as well.
    Health I think should be the first stat shown, it seems awkward for Health to be anything other than first. As a result of this, however, the first column is now devoted to defensive based stats while the second column is offensive based. The organization for the rest is fairly straightforward.
    Note the health bar is right above the stats, which could be partial. Showing health there could lead to confusion as it is not immediately clear if the value displayed is current or max health. Could be handled by interface text,... but I think the best approach would be to include it as text on the health bar or as a mouse over instead as "[CurrentHealth]/[MaxHealth]. Leaving more space for other stats as well.

    I think if bloodtype is to be included, it fits much more on the top panel than it would on the bottom panel,... The top one is now made up on creature characteristics, or what the creature 'is', the bottom one with the creature behavior/skills, or what the creature 'does'. Blood type fits the former, not the latter.

    Also, I think 'most basic to less basic' makes less sense in ordering as 'Most important to least important.' I think the Pay value will be the one stat looked at the most, more than all the others combined. The Training skill not having an opposite, combined with the iffy description of blood type, makes it seem the latter is somehow connected to the former. And the 4 'skills' are now unordered(nobody likes a T piece). So keeping your selection of skills I would go for:

    Code:
    Gold Held	Gold Wage
    Research Skill	Manufacture Skill
    Scavenge Skill	Training Skill
    Loyalty		BloodType
    Lair Size	Hunger Fill

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