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Thread: Second Euphine War fixes

  
  1. #1
    Warlock
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    402

    Default Second Euphine War fixes

    Okay, I've been playing this map, and while good on paper, there's been a lot of issues I have with the level that, frankly, made it unplayable. So I've decided to do some changes:
    1. Cleaned up the level coding.
    2. Implemented objectives which explain what to do, especially since nobody will expect the massive army near the end.
    3. Trying to find a purpose for the Tunneller and the Armageddon Spell.
    or that is the question

  2. #2

    Default Re: Second Euphine War fixes

    This map you mean?

    And you're just rubbing our noses in it, that you now have a good map? Since you don't share it.

  3. #3
    Warlock
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    402

    Default Re: Second Euphine War fixes

    Quote Originally Posted by YourMaster View Post
    This map you mean?

    And you're just rubbing our noses in it, that you now have a good map? Since you don't share it.
    It's a work in progress. Would have devoted more time to DK, but IRL happened.

    But I cleaned up the coding, had some basic messages (With some swearing), but I'm still wondering what purpose Tunneller and Armageddon were meant to serve.

    https://www.dropbox.com/sh/z49dbuhfb...OtfdY_NFa?dl=0
    Last edited by Hades; December 27th, 2016 at 17:49.
    or that is the question

  4. #4

    Default Re: Second Euphine War fixes

    I've never played this map, but I just now took a quick look. First thing I noticed is that in both your version and the original you have a "DWARF" instead of "DWARFA" in party1.

    I think the Tunneler is mostly there because the mapmaker thinks that's cool, but he did use it a bit. The imp spell is taken away when PLAYER3 is gone, a Tunneler is easier to keep alive and not screw your chances. And as you lose when you haven't got Armageddon yet when you take out PLAYER3 and There's the red tile to the south-east, I figure he wants you to go that route and take out those heroes there before you do this. Possibly use the Armageddon spell to win the map, while keeping the tunneler alive.

    Have you looked at the first map to get any clues?

    EDIT:

    Taking a second look, I think he wants to make it impossible to take out PLAYER2 before taking down the heroes. The player can try to dig through, but notice he won't be able to breach the dungeon and thus decide to go for the Armageddon spell. Once you have it you don't need it because you are rewarded with a bridge.
    It think this is also why you lose the map when you take over PLAYER3 before taking out the heroes, because you would get the destroy walls spell there, and that would allow you to win before he wants you to. Not a very elegant solution.
    Last edited by YourMaster; December 27th, 2016 at 18:45.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Second Euphine War fixes

    I've now played the map (your work in progress) and it's interesting but indeed needs some work. In it's current form I think most people won't be able to beat it.

    First of all, the final hero party that comes truly is unbeatable, and you don't know when it's coming or how to prevent this. When you take too long defeating the first keeper there is very little you can do about this by the time you realize you should have done something differently. I suggest to only start the timer when the you either kill this keeper or trigger an action point inside the hero dungeon. It will help to draw a bit more attention to the white hearth that needs to be killed in order to stop these parties. You could pre-dig out a path towards it, so that the player sees the white wall from the start.
    And after you defeat party 5, update the objective text message to tell the player that the next one will kill him so he knows he has to really hurry.

    Second, I was really annoyed by my tunneler that kept dying. They just won't stay in one spot and just take a single hit from a samurai or giant to die and lose you the game. I think this mechanic is put in place on this map to stop you from getting millions of imps with the temple you take from Yellow, as you lose the ability to create imps when yellow is defeated. To make the map more fun, simply put in place a piece of script that prevents you from creating more than 16 imps when you own a temple and remove the script that kills you when you lose the Tunneler.

    The order in this map seems to be: 1) Kill Blue. 2) Claim yellow library. 3) Kill white. 4) Claim white library. 5) Kill Yellow. 6) Kill green.
    What really doesn't work is that the player can't know this and dies when he kills the yellow keeper before claiming the white library, while it makes sense to do so. As soon as green took out most of yellows creatures I took my change to finish him off and claim the rooms but lost immediately, and I had read the script beforehand. Perhaps this was put in place to punish you when green takes out yellow, but it has to change. At the very least you've got to put text messages in place, but I suggest to just completely redesign this bit.

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