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Thread: Simulating creature fight...what the?

  
  1. #1

    Question Simulating creature fight...what the?

    Hey,

    So I was comparing creature stats, making a table with all the parameters etc. and was trying to calculate/simulate a fight between any 2 creatures. Based on their level, respective health/damage and delays in the attack.
    Specifically I wanted to get a number of hits necessary to kill the opponent and amount of time (in sec) it would take.

    For example lets take level 1 Black Knight against level 1 Mistress.
    Level 1 Black Knight has 4 000 HP , 400 damage and attack interval of 2 seconds (recharge time 1.5 sec. + 0.5 sec shot time).
    Level 1 Mistress has 2 000 HP , 480 damage and attack interval of 2.54 seconds (recharge time 1.79 sec. + 0.75 sec shot time).

    It would seem that Black Knight would need exactly 5 hits and 8 seconds to take out Lvl 1 Mistress.
    Calculations for Black Knight:
    00:00:00 First strike landing - 400 hp
    00:00:02 2nd strike - 400 hp
    00:00:04 3rd strike - 400 hp
    00:00:06 4th strike - 400 hp
    00:00:08 5th strike - 400 hp and Mistress is out
    ================
    But a real game test in a combat pit has nothing to do with these calculations.
    It took 11 hits and 21.8 seconds for Lvl 1 Black Knight to take out Lvl 1 Mistress.
    How? How is the game calculating damage? The attack delay time is correct, tested it in a game. It just seems that correlation between damage and health is not direct, meaning that attack of 400 damage is not equal to health minus 400 hp ? Anyone knows how its calculated?

  2. #2
    Awakening Game Master Metal Gear Rex's Avatar
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    Default Re: Simulating creature fight...what the?

    Three factors come to mind.

    1) Specifically what you're mentioning is the Combat Pit. The Combat Pit has reduced damage of real combat. I believe it's 40% of real combat. One of the reasons why it's so powerful.

    2) North vs south. Either a bug or some quirky feature but if a creature attacks another creature who is, even if very slightly, positioned north of the attacker, they will have a 50% damage increase.

    3) Animation speeds can matter more than melee attack, in fact they usually do. Creatures will not attempt another action like a second attack until they finish their last attack animation. This is why Black Knights beat normal Knights as while they both mirror 1 animation, their other animation is shorter for the BK and longer for the Knight, so the BK gets more attacks in. Recharge times for melee attacks tends to be lower than the actual animations, which matters for possession. Beyond that, battles can be decided based on which attack animation can be used as longer animations are bad.

    Additionally, shot delay and recharge times aren't quite linked. Once a creature attempts to attack, the recharge time starts. The shot delay is just amount of time before the damage actually hits. It does not effect recharge time, but I believe if you were to increase the delay beyond the animation time, it would extend the action.
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  3. #3

    Default Re: Simulating creature fight...what the?

    Thank a lot for your reply.
    I was not aware of any of these factors, especially about Combat Pit having less damage. Weird, with all those hours spent in a game, I never took notice of this. I looked through the level variables, it indeed says the Pit has 20% of damage. It looked more like 40% in my first test, but anyway. Probably missed something.

    When I initiated 1vs 1 fight outside the pit, it took exactly 5 shots and exactly 8 seconds for Black Knight to deal with Mistress, as I initially thought. What I did miss though, is that creatures are not killed instantly, they fall unconscious with some % of health still left (1/6 of total or so).
    So when I put Dark Angel (840 Dmg, 3000 HP) vs Black Knight (400 Dmg, 4000 HP), I thought Angel would need 5 hits to kill BK, but it took only 4 as some % of health is preserved. Only I can't find a variable for that yet.

  4. #4
    Awakening Game Master Metal Gear Rex's Avatar
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    Default Re: Simulating creature fight...what the?

    Quote Originally Posted by Flanker View Post
    I was not aware of any of these factors, especially about Combat Pit having less damage. Weird, with all those hours spent in a game, I never took notice of this.
    This is not uncommon. DK2 is incredibly easy by design, which is why people don't notice a lot of things as they never matter, and I believe intentionally so.

    Quote Originally Posted by Flanker View Post
    I looked through the level variables, it indeed says the Pit has 20% of damage. It looked more like 40% in my first test, but anyway. Probably missed something.
    There's two variables. "Combat Pit Melee Damage Modifier (Percentage)" and "Pit -% Damage Taken of Normal Combat". Both are close by each other at the end of the list, post gambling settings.

    The first one is additive, the second is a multiplier. The first is set to 100 by default, and the second is set to 20, so you get (1.0 + 1.0) * 0.2 for 40%. To emulate real combat, set the first value to 0 and the second value to 100.

    Quote Originally Posted by Flanker View Post
    When I initiated 1vs 1 fight outside the pit, it took exactly 5 shots and exactly 8 seconds for Black Knight to deal with Mistress, as I initially thought. What I did miss though, is that creatures are not killed instantly, they fall unconscious with some % of health still left (1/6 of total or so).
    So when I put Dark Angel (840 Dmg, 3000 HP) vs Black Knight (400 Dmg, 4000 HP), I thought Angel would need 5 hits to kill BK, but it took only 4 as some % of health is preserved. Only I can't find a variable for that yet.
    I retested this myself. This does seem to be the case, you may have triggered the North vs South bug accidentally.
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